Why do schools have dances? Why do many high schools host parties, sometimes inter-school parties at the school?
A school isn't just a machine that puts knowledge into people's brains, it's an organization of people. And those people will want to celebrate together from time to time. This WILL happen. "official" events can be more inclusive.
But also for young people it's a part of social education, providing some baseline for how you interact with other people.
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myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Schools dances, office holiday parties can be kind of corny and boring. So many people have input on what can and cannot be done that you might end up with a very limited and boring event.
But, these things are still very important (the office parties less so, I think)-- they have an "educational purpose"
And this is why schools need to come to grips with running social media intranets.
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myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Right now teens go off into the wild to find a place on social media and adults are rightly alarmed. Companies like Facebook, Instagram, X etc. have no interest in "modeling a healthy online environment" or "teaching young people to use social media constructively" -- instead everyone is acting like simply banning kids from using phones and scanning IDs will make social media go away.
No one is asking or answering the question: How and when will young people learn to use social media?
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Roger BW 😷
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I think that schools should take on this role.
You could have a server for a school with mastodon, but not connected to the rest of the fedi, you could network with similar schools. Just like at the school dance the teachers are around so there are limits to how it's used.
Teens could post about their soccer games, advertise their clubs, make jokes, practice using the medium wisely.
When teens post to social media they care about their friends at school seeing the post most. 4/
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myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I've had people hear this idea scoff saying "teens will never use it" I don't think this is true. They ALL come to the dances, even though they are "so boring" -- and I think at some level they would feel better having a safer place to express themselves in photos, videos and writing for each other without every creep on the internet looking in on it.
Will some teens still find internet "after parties" Yes.
But right now we are basically saying you can go to the afterparty or NOTHING.
5/5
myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •What is more true is the adults don't want to bother to set it up.
Just like no one really wants to chaperone the dance.
But we have figured out that NOT having the dance is worse.
It will leave some kids locked out socially, others will create events that are too adult or unsafe.
We need to show them how it could work. Part of the obstacle to doing this is how few *adults* know how to use social media in a constructive way. So maybe we all need lessons.
Wyatt H Knott
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to Wyatt H Knott • • •@Wyatt_H_Knott
Don't take blocking personally unless you were having a real conversation with the person and they felt the need to tell you why.
I think some people block me because I "post too much" -- and you know? That is fine. Because I do.
Wyatt H Knott
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •reading with a dog at my feet
in reply to Wyatt H Knott • • •I made some dismissive backhanded compliment because I didn't respect genre writing, and she was having none of that.
When the people you're interacting with have meaning to you beyond the Internet I think it's very good for building better social skills.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •As a teacher who is always looking out for kids who struggle with "socializing" the part about being shut out really bothers me.
When I was in HS internet was a secret world for a few dozen nerdy kids who knew about it. Now it's more like the socially savvy kids figure it out, and even manage to use it rather responsibly, but the kids who are more like I was... they have no idea what's going on or where to start and they are just left out.
That sucks.
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myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I mean the "secret club for nerds" was not great either but at least it wasn't concentrating social power in the hands of the already socially skilled and powerful.
But, that's what's going on now. Your shy socially awkward kid may at best find some kindred souls online, but at worst?
A chatbot may fill their head with nonsense or they will get preyed on by internet creeps.
And the later was already happening when I was young.
A school should at least set one good example.
Peppermint Solstice Faith
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •There's something in all this that's triggering to me at a pretty deep level and I'm not 100% sure what it is. I think it has something to do with control.
As someone who was manipulated from a young age and who was bullied by kids and adults alike, the Internet for me was a necessary escape. I needed not only to communicate through text but with people outside my community. I didn't really know it at the time but I also needed a place where things wouldn't get back to my parents.
Now I don't know all the social dynamics of how school kids are using social media and I'll readily admit it probably isn't healthy. If kids are getting treated okay in the halls where teachers are watching and then cyberbullied by their peers over lunch, that's bad. And the popularity contest that is IG pretty 😬.
But I'm not sure if social media being a direct extension of school is great, either. For the kids for whom what they say and do making it back to their community is a useful motivatior for good behavior, it may help. But for the kid who everyone has silently
... show moreThere's something in all this that's triggering to me at a pretty deep level and I'm not 100% sure what it is. I think it has something to do with control.
As someone who was manipulated from a young age and who was bullied by kids and adults alike, the Internet for me was a necessary escape. I needed not only to communicate through text but with people outside my community. I didn't really know it at the time but I also needed a place where things wouldn't get back to my parents.
Now I don't know all the social dynamics of how school kids are using social media and I'll readily admit it probably isn't healthy. If kids are getting treated okay in the halls where teachers are watching and then cyberbullied by their peers over lunch, that's bad. And the popularity contest that is IG pretty 😬.
But I'm not sure if social media being a direct extension of school is great, either. For the kids for whom what they say and do making it back to their community is a useful motivatior for good behavior, it may help. But for the kid who everyone has silently agreed it's okay to bully, it just extends that hell to their phone.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Peppermint Solstice Faith • • •@faithisleaping
I think that adults don't do anything about the bullying and have not created any way for students to say it is happening is the real failure.
And if kids want to use the wider internet they still can. I just think what we have now is by default exclusionary since only those kids with parents who help them use the internet, or those with parents who don't care know what's going on at all.
Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@faithisleaping
Beyond just not doing anything about bullies, the school system I went to treated *me* as the problem for 1) *being* bullied, 2) honestly expecting teachers to do their alleged job in stopping bullies, and 3) just generally not fitting in (*especially* because "fitting in" is what girls are "supposed to be" good at).
I half-wonder if some faculty secretly thinks bullying is a *good* thing that punishes misfits for them.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary • • •@pteryx @faithisleaping
"I half-wonder if some faculty secretly thinks bullying is a *good* thing that punishes misfits for them."
There are adults who think this. They are real and they are incorrect.
No, I can't make an outcast kid feel like they are a part of the class 100 percent. But, I can make them feel like they are just as valued as everyone else and deserve to be treated with respect.
Teens don't like it when you point out they are being a jerk. They will stop, or tone it down.
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myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@pteryx @faithisleaping
In fact, I've seen some pretty dramatic changes just from pointing out that "no one wants to be treated like that" and "you are being mean."
It's your job if you are the adult.
Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I'm pretty sure the majority of my own bullies knew damned well that they were being mean and no one would want to be treated the way I was; beyond merely not caring, they actively wanted to harm me specifically. There *was*, however, a minority who didn't actually *want* to bully me and was peer-pressured into it.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary • • •Oh the kids I've spoken to know what they are doing too. They do not like having it pointed out by an adult.
That the adults didn't do anything for you or acted like they couldn't is a failure on their part.
Kids will be mean on purpose because it can feel grown up and powerful. They see it in media, or they know an adult like that. They don't always think about the fallout fully.
But when another adult isn't impressed it's not so mature and worldly seeming anymore.
Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •At first, the teachers *did* scold the bullies... and that didn't work, which meant that the teachers got frustrated with my continuing to ask them to perform a futile task, which quite frankly had a lot to do with them starting to treat me as the problem for expecting them to do their jobs.
Tattie
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I'm seeing people in this thread who were let down so badly by their schools, and the trauma caused by that abandonment, that betrayal, is still so very real and present. I feel that, as another person with lifelong cPTSD caused by emotional abuse in the school environment.
(I refuse to even give it the respectable label of "bullying"-- it was calculated, intentional, repeated, emotional traumatisation.)
But I want to "pay forwards" to you my thanks for standing up to abuse, for stopping it happening where you have power.
Because throughout the hell that was secondary school, a tiny handful of teachers were willing and able to say "not in my classroom". I remember looking thru my diary and feeling the visceral relief that I had science that day, or English. For 55 blessed minutes, my nervous system could recover from the state of hypervigilance that I was spending every other hour of my day in.
I am not exaggerating when I call those teachers lifesavers.
@pteryx @faithisleaping
rk: it’s hyphen-minus actually
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@pteryx @faithisleaping
I had a teacher in high school ask the whole class at the beginning of the period to pray for me since I hadn’t let Jesus into my heart. Good times.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to rk: it’s hyphen-minus actually • • •@rk @pteryx @faithisleaping
That is wild.
And by wild I mean wrong.
I'm assuming this was all sincere?
rk: it’s hyphen-minus actually
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@pteryx @faithisleaping
Small town Texas in 1995 or 1996. Good times.
Sin Vega
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@pteryx @faithisleaping I've done this with strangers on the bus once, they'd been dumping on the one girl in the group for far too long and I just snapped at them
they got a BIT defensive but in a self-soothing way, and they did lay off her. Sure, teenagers often won't admit it when they realise they were being a dick. But they tend to reel it in, yeah
trachelipus
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I can say with 100% certainty my elementary school considered bullying to be a necessary social skill. It was like they were grooming us to work for or marry into the Ewing family.
Emile Snyder
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •R
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •i see the "socialization" goal you're describing, but i don't think schools should be doing it, and *especially* not an _american_ school
to start with your example of dances, parties, sportsball, and clubs, all of these activities feel like they *deeply* bake in assumptions of "you are already expected and assumed to be familiar ahead of time with typical generic american high school culture". when i was in high school, i "knew" that such activities were happening (in the "they get listed in the daily bulletin" sense), but i never had *any* context on why i would or should even care (and certainly never attended any). i've been noticing that this seems to be a really pervasive problem: "generic american culture" is so widely disseminated and exported especially in mass media that there's almost *never* even a *consideration* for "what if you're just... not plugged in to any of those channels?". this might be finally coming to a head (in a "bad" way) as consensus on the media landscape has started breaking hard in the past few years
in general, i'm entirely a proponent
... show morei see the "socialization" goal you're describing, but i don't think schools should be doing it, and *especially* not an _american_ school
to start with your example of dances, parties, sportsball, and clubs, all of these activities feel like they *deeply* bake in assumptions of "you are already expected and assumed to be familiar ahead of time with typical generic american high school culture". when i was in high school, i "knew" that such activities were happening (in the "they get listed in the daily bulletin" sense), but i never had *any* context on why i would or should even care (and certainly never attended any). i've been noticing that this seems to be a really pervasive problem: "generic american culture" is so widely disseminated and exported especially in mass media that there's almost *never* even a *consideration* for "what if you're just... not plugged in to any of those channels?". this might be finally coming to a head (in a "bad" way) as consensus on the media landscape has started breaking hard in the past few years
in general, i'm entirely a proponent of the approach of "you are allowed to explore, discover, and take your own risks, even dangerous risks, as long as you understand that you won't be (as) protected if you do so. hopefully 'we' (as in, society) will provide some ways to talk about what happens (although this doesn't always work)", which feels most similar to the approach i grew up with and the way i personally understood the ideals of the 2000s-2010s internet. i don't see schools, where attendance is (approximately) compulsory, as a good environment for this type of discovery. (fwiw the vibe i got from my own high school was that they _firmly_ washed their hands of anything to do with social media, unsanctioned unofficial events, and generally anything not *clearly* part of their legal responsibilities)
Sepideh
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •When I was in high school, it was a nerdy high school so we had several people running their own Linux servers.
On the Linux servers, we were writing interactive fiction on one particular BBS board. I kept inserting a particular boyfriend who did not want to be in the fiction, and he would immediately add the next chapter to the story killing his own character off because he did not want to be in the story.
There was one student who posted "I am bisexual" to all the boards.
regular violet
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •For me, the Internet went from the only place I was comfortable in high school to just another social nightmare in the last 10 years. I have wondered what it's like for kids today.
It doesn't seem like there's any niche place to express themselves without the threat of bullying at all.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to regular violet • • •@thecrushedviolet
They have carved out little spaces on tumblr and instagram.
But they also use discord and things like that a lot.
Discord kind of scares me because who knows what's going on in there? I hope that the older students take to heart our lessons about setting boundaries and asking for help.
But this isn't a new problem, it's always been part of growing up.
Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@thecrushedviolet
At least you recognize bullying as a serious problem at all.
As for learning about setting boundaries and asking for help... quite frankly, the lesson I took away from how the faculty treated me at school is that authority figures will do anything, *ANYTHING*, to minimize their own workload, and therefore asking appointed or self-selected authority figures for help is not just futile, but potentially counterproductive as they turn on you.
A Flock of Beagles
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •nevermind adults not knowing how to use social media, most people don't know how to set up and manage a server of any kind.
i don't know what teachers and school kids know about computers and how to connect them these days, but in my days in public school, the kids barely knew what a floppy disc is, and the teachers were afraid of computers. they wouldn't let you plug in a keyboard that became disconnected, they would insist on calling a technician, and no one actually had that role as far as i could tell. they had been maybe trained on how to do various software tasks but if something wasn't working they were absolutely lost.
they were definitely not going to be teaching us anything they didn't know, and they weren't going to suggest a project where we all learn together because that would break the student-teacher hierarchy. many of the teachers in my high school were not at all secure in their ability to teach the subjects they taught. in my later years, i met someone outside of school who was a math major, and who ended being a TA for one of the math teachers at my
... show morenevermind adults not knowing how to use social media, most people don't know how to set up and manage a server of any kind.
i don't know what teachers and school kids know about computers and how to connect them these days, but in my days in public school, the kids barely knew what a floppy disc is, and the teachers were afraid of computers. they wouldn't let you plug in a keyboard that became disconnected, they would insist on calling a technician, and no one actually had that role as far as i could tell. they had been maybe trained on how to do various software tasks but if something wasn't working they were absolutely lost.
they were definitely not going to be teaching us anything they didn't know, and they weren't going to suggest a project where we all learn together because that would break the student-teacher hierarchy. many of the teachers in my high school were not at all secure in their ability to teach the subjects they taught. in my later years, i met someone outside of school who was a math major, and who ended being a TA for one of the math teachers at my school. no joke, he told me that the teacher he was assigned to told him to "do the homework to make sure you know how to do it". a high school math teacher said that to a person with a degree in math. we also had gym teachers teaching English, and other weird misassignments of skill and knowledge.
SeanBurlington 🌈 🕊️
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •during lockdown I reached out to school to see if I could help with IT
They didn't take up my offer - but what I learned through the process is that schools have less than minimal IT support , there is no IT manager, in house support person, purchasing officer - nothing.
Schools and Youth groups need better funding, till then kids are at the mercy of the evil corporations
Daniel M. Reck
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •This is a fascinating idea and you've used an excellent social education metaphor in the school dance.
The great roadblock I anticipate would need to be overcome would be the legal liability, followed by the political and moral panic.
I was about to say no one freaks out about teaching math—but yeah, they do. Folks definitely freak out *more* when educators teach social skills or anything bordering on someone's idea of morality. This'd allow students to express themselves. Oh no!
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Daniel M. Reck • • •@DanielMReck
I would think hosting dances would have a lot more "liabilities"
Daniel M. Reck
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •That's because you're sensible.
Dances do not typically create a perfect digital record of everything that happens at them, and social media platforms typically do. That's great for people investigating actual wrongdoing, but it also makes a gold mine of innocent content to be used by profit-seeking lawyers and disingenuous adults to intimidate, harass, and legally destroy whatever school tried to implement such a platform.
There's also those generally-ignored child privacy laws.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Daniel M. Reck • • •@DanielMReck
The school email, gchat, google classroom and websites already do that.
Daniel M. Reck
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Good point.
I may have made an incorrect assumption that you were proposing that a school homegrow or otherwise implement its own social media platform...like a Mastodon instance.
The services you identified are all provided by third parties under contract with the school. That contract provides obligations for those parties to assure FERPA-protected and other private data is kept safe. This provides a certain indemnity under the reasonable actor standard. (At least where I work.)
Chris [list of emoji]
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •The most efficient way to do this is to have a centralized organization to do this. This shares the costs of IT across every school that needs it. A school would contract them out to set up an instance and provide mod privileges to the teachers willing to do this.
The org could also do other cloud services (email, wiki, owncloud, etc) as an alternative to MS or Google.
And then, SV capital could buy the org and sell students' data to advertisers
Thanasis Kinias
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Grant_H
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •They weren't interested. They wanted to be where everyone else is (IG) above all. I asked them who was going to start the "new thing" if not them, but they didn't want to put in the effort.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Grant_H • • •@grant_h
When it's just one teacher saying "set up this thing" it just sounds like more work.
You need to get the admins on board.
Make it the place where the scores from the sports teams are announced, where the vote totals from the elections are posted, that is make it part of the school and they'll care about it.
My students love the idea, it's the admins and other teachers who I can't get excited.
Grant_H
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •They just had to post the content.
potentially hazardous object
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@grant_h did the adults themselves express interest in using it, including using it themselves and not infrequently showing interesting things on it?
and were things other than pixelfed considered? (i still do not see anything pixelfed can do that multiple other fedi platforms don't do better)
myrmepropagandist
in reply to potentially hazardous object • • •I haven't gotten as far as talking about software yet. Though I'm starting to think the way to sell them on this is to point out how much more elegant it would be than our current school electronic communication which is basically everyone spams everyone with email all the time.
Every club, team, department, etc. is just posting stuff to these horrible listserves like it's usenet and there are no forums. Just one big forum.
This would be a way to tame the chaos.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@apophis @grant_h
Today, on a sunday I have 130 school email notifications and all of them are from the listservs and I need to open most of them and look to see what it is.
OK I'll open like half of them.
But it's a mess.
Nonetheless we are already a school where students and teachers do mass digital communication in the community all the time.
Grant_H
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Here (South Africa) there are a coue of dedicated school comms packages.
Privacy is also a thing - parents with access to teachers private phone num ers is a big no at my school, which I appreciate. Also, email has an auditable trail, not something most social media platorms have.
Grant_H
in reply to Grant_H • • •During covid, we set up (in house) Woocommerce sites so the matrics could do their fundraising bake sales, etc. Worked really well - but they had the motivation.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Grant_H • • •@grant_h
That said? I feel like this is coming. It may take like a decade but schools will figure it out.
The most ugly school social media problems happen when students have an "unofficial official" network and no one knows about it but some mean girls/guys.
Grant_H
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •potentially hazardous object
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Darkly? I think the big social media companies do not really want young people to be "empowered digital citizens" or "people who can set boundaries, and make wise choices about the online spaces they participate in"
They want them to be like many adults, kind of helpless and unable to look away from a kind of social media that makes their mental health worse while wasting their time and selling them garbage.
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Sassinake! - ⊃∪∩⪽
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •just had a flash that 'I am addicted to the internet'.
but it will pass, let me just scrol
Canageek
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Orion Ussner kidder
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Graeme Hilton
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •A mastodon instance per year group could be a nice alternative. But they already have a school provided "social media" which is strictly moderated - maybe too strictly.
Jeff "Never puts the Oven Mitts away" Cliff, B.Sc.
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •> They ALL come to the dances
I didn't. Most dances I absolutely refused to participate in, and the one or two that I didn't I mostly stayed on the bleachers away from everyone.
And of course the one that I *did* go to someone wound up getting seriously injured / (killed?). So there was that.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Jeff "Never puts the Oven Mitts away" Cliff, B.Sc. • • •@jeffcliff
I guess I'm an unlikely champion of the school dance considering I hated the whole concept as a kid, only went to one under duress (it was too loud) and never went again.
I get a different perspective as a teacher and hope that we've encouraged something better than what I was exposed to when I was younger (which to be fair wasn't as bad as it could have been, even in 1997 I somehow was at a school that didn't mandate )
That all of the students show up I take as a good sign.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@jeffcliff
My mom and dad, experienced a very different kind of school dance in the 1960s. It was very focused on straight dating cosplay I guess?
There were a billion rules about buying flowers for a girl and if you could pick her up in your horrible car.
These things evolve.
That said. I liked knowing I COULD go to the school dance and not going more than I'd like if all the parties were the kind where I wouldn't be invited.
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@stevewfolds
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Ballroom dance was an extra in 1961, taught in the junior high school’s gym. A community center held “canteens” Saturday nights in Summer. Dancing cheek to cheek at 13.
pejacoby
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •so much THIS!
*but* you have to get the ADULTS to not be the idiots in the room. 6 or 7 years ago our local charter school had a Facebook group, and the kids did NOT interact with it because there were one or two adults absolutely sucking ALL the oxygen out of the room with their bad takes and frankly 12-year-old behavior, modeling the worst of the worst to the student population.
This was before the current-day miasma that is FB and others, sadly predictive of current state…
Zulkiers
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I never made it to a single dance. Not even prom.
caffetino
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to caffetino • • •@caffetino
"But imagine the tech team and the moderation needed"
They already use email, put up fliers, and do many things with communication that schools have ways to manage.
"Moderation" starts in the classroom. My students know how I expect them to treat each other. If anything it would be easier than some of the "she said x" but I didn't HEAR her say it so it's harder to be fair I deal with already.
But, mostly, the social media will just reflect the existing school culture.
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myrmepropagandist
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •@caffetino
If your school culture is mostly right and you don't have many problems with bullying you won't see it in the online space.
If there is a problem it seems like the problem needs to be addressed at the root. In the classroom and halls.
Shar(yna)Tran/Shark(aeopteryx)
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •This is somewhere I really think what they're doing at the Bonfire project could really shine! Especially since there's account data migration so after they leave they still get to bring their memories with them.
(preemptive link for anyone who happens across this who doesn't know: bonfirenetworks.org/app/social… )
Bonfire
bonfirenetworks.orgColesStreetPothole
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Bill Seitz
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to Bill Seitz • • •@billseitz
Teachers, as we always do for any school activity. Same rules.
But there could also be some work for student government. (we have student government make the dress code and this works well)
GothGardener
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Hippasus500 aka jwn2
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •This is a wonderful idea, except for the “not connected” part.
Many secondary schools have introductory computer science programs. Students could gain practical experience in sysadministration, gain valuable experience in moderation and social responsibility, serve the schools wider community, and popularize the model of a federated social media.
A lot ^could^ go wrong, I know. But if we wish to have an educated citizenry, this would be a way.
Micha Baum
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Gibt es Erfahrungen oder Gründe die gegen einen schulinternen Mastodon-Server sprechen?
Daniel Lakeland
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •My impression is that Bonfire would be a great way to go, and that remaining federated would be OK if the moderation team was good.
I'd love to do this for Pasadena unified, and I think I could probably partner with Pasadena education foundation to do it not as a school thing but as a foundation thing the school could promote. moderation could be teachers and parents like PTA members... maybe I'll look into this in the new year? it goes along with the library stuff ive been doing...
eswillwalker
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to eswillwalker • • •@ELS
Schools have email and this isn't an issue? What new liabilities would be raised?
eswillwalker
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to eswillwalker • • •@ELS
I don't really see the point of having an anonymous network inside of a school. Hadn't even thought of doing that.
eswillwalker
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to eswillwalker • • •@ELS
School email is just regular email although out-of-school incoming mail is blocked by a whitelist that includes parents and a few others.
No "anonymous" accounts is part of the "boring school party" aspect.
Mark Whybird
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist reshared this.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Mark Whybird • • •@whybird
That policy sounds like the adults are just plugging their ears.
Daniel Lakeland
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Francisco
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •geolaw
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •CynthesisToday
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •A friend had a very intelligent way of doing this, I thought:
Starting with texting, he made clear (and followed through) that he would be able to see and review every text sent/received from first receipt of phone (end of elementary school) to age 16. Same with social media. They had a regular time to review and discuss.
It also gave them a language and space to talk about pretty much any growing up topics, too.
ColesStreetPothole
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Rachel Rawlings
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •My high school had a BBS that was run by students who had already been on other BBSes, with a faculty advisor, but became a lot of people's first experience online.
We put it together with an Apple ][ and a 10MB Sider drive that lived in a locked carrel in the gifted room.
Bram Moreinis
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •gbsills
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •lizzard
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Jeremy Kahn
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •OMG I have a 13 yo now and he's a great kid and he loves his school and community
It would be so great for him and his friends to have a loosely supervised social media account run through his moderately sized school (200 5th-8th graders)
CubeOfCheese
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •A-Ho-Ho-Ho-aly BSC SSC
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •In my 20's I worked as Youth Worker, Social Worker and managed several children's centres.
The social education of young people was at the core of everything we did. It worked, so much that I did on occasion run into some of those young people as adults and not only did they remember me... but did so fondly, recounting some of the great memories they had where I worked.
I had a rule where, I wouldn't let kids win a basic games just for the sake of them winning. I challenged them to do better, to think ahead, plan ahead... I wasn't mean or condescending and I would often give ample opportunity for them to see the errors they were about to make... I never gloated, I always congratulated them on a good game.
One of the best memories I have is playing a simple game of Connect 4 with one of the kids... He'd been coming to the after school and holiday clubs for several years. He loved connect 4... but could never beat me... Until he did... at the age of about 10yrs old and after several years of trying.
The look of sheer joy on his face is one I will never forget
... show moreIn my 20's I worked as Youth Worker, Social Worker and managed several children's centres.
The social education of young people was at the core of everything we did. It worked, so much that I did on occasion run into some of those young people as adults and not only did they remember me... but did so fondly, recounting some of the great memories they had where I worked.
I had a rule where, I wouldn't let kids win a basic games just for the sake of them winning. I challenged them to do better, to think ahead, plan ahead... I wasn't mean or condescending and I would often give ample opportunity for them to see the errors they were about to make... I never gloated, I always congratulated them on a good game.
One of the best memories I have is playing a simple game of Connect 4 with one of the kids... He'd been coming to the after school and holiday clubs for several years. He loved connect 4... but could never beat me... Until he did... at the age of about 10yrs old and after several years of trying.
The look of sheer joy on his face is one I will never forget... talk about a core memory... for both of us. He was celebrating his victory, not in a mocking or condescending way... just pure joy at his achievement beating a far better player.
He was telling everyone, he was the first kid to beat me. When his mum arrived to pick him up it was the first thing he ran up to tell her... and he was giddy with joy.
I ran into him about 15yrs later by chance... When we realised who he was... guess what his first memory of our interactions was... He still beamed with joy recall his win.
I'm a great believer in social education, and I miss those roles I had, helping to shape young minds... But the money was garbage and I didn't want to live in poverty forever... so as I approached 30, I went and got a better paid boring office job for the next 25yrs.
myrmepropagandist reshared this.
Abie
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •A party for all the families with games and cake in primary school, with maybe a school play.
Nothing beyond "bring cake to the last period of the semester/year" if the teacher is cool with it after that.
I don't think I would have gone to a school ball voluntarily.
plan-A
in reply to myrmepropagandist • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to plan-A • • •@zer0unplanned
Just a school? In this case "High School" the last four years before a kid will graduate and maybe go to college or start a job.
So school for kids age 14-18 years old?
I don't know if I understood your question.
like this
plan-A and Bitslingers-R-Us like this.
plan-A
in reply to myrmepropagandist • •myrmepropagandist likes this.
Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •It's possible that the disconnect is not taking for granted (or perhaps even grasping) the concept of a large, organized school. There are cultures that *don't* herd all their children into big, compulsory educational institutions together.
Three plus or minus five
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I actually ... don't hate this. Supervision (i.e. moderation) is an issue, but assumably could be done similarly to sports or clubs (putting yet more burden on overworked teachers, but that's another issue.
(But also too: school dances and sporting events and yearbooks all had the express purpose of showing me just how excluded I was from the community. Same will happen with this.)
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Three plus or minus five • • •@ThreeSigma
(But also too: school dances and sporting events and yearbooks all had the express purpose of showing me just how excluded I was from the community. Same will happen with this.)
That's how I felt about them too. I didn't attend my school's prom, for example.
But I think I would have liked it even less if it was one of those events I wasn't even invited to. (which also existed and only looking back can I see how obnoxious it was that the kids who went had to let me know)
Three plus or minus five
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Let me validate your choice: I went and really really wish I hadn't.
But yeah, your point is taken. And sometimes there's a quiet kid who can write like an angel and has the most interesting thoughts. Maybe they'd share.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Three plus or minus five • • •@ThreeSigma
There was this 1950 style soda fountain where I grew up and it was a big deal to go there for milkshakes on friday's
The entire class except for me and the other two unpopular girls would go.
Very obnoxious. Though that was middle school.
Hypolite Petovan
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to Hypolite Petovan • • •@hypolite
How do French teens have social events? Clubs? Church? Just small things with friends?
Hypolite Petovan
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to Hypolite Petovan • • •@hypolite
I'm trying to think if there is something other than the school that could provide some pretext of "neutral ground" to serve as the place for youth social media... though I don't know much about France so it is kind of beyond me.
In the US schools take on a LOT of this role as it is. If it's not the schools it's the church... (I would take the schools...)
Hypolite Petovan
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •Cassandrich
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to Cassandrich • • •@dalias
Oh that gets in the mix too. But not in the NYC city schools.
They don't really do much "romantic" dancing. They just eat all the snacks and argue about what music to play then dance in a circle.
Which is fine.
Cassandrich
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •myrmepropagandist
in reply to Cassandrich • • •@dalias
There are always a few gay prom dates, but also sometimes friends will go together and it's not romantic.
There are also lots of girls and guys who will go to prom together and that's common but not mandatory.
The seniors are mostly interested in getting very cute photos with the backdrops they spend WAY TOO MUCH TIME making and they make a huge mess.
Anyway.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Cassandrich • • •@dalias
I guess it will vary by school. Obviously.
Pomegranate_Stew
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •I realize this isn’t about the social aspect, but I do wish that the music at dances wasn’t at literally deafening levels. I’m fairly certain a good percentage of my hearing loss is from attending high school dances where my ears were left ringing afterwards. My two kids who attended one during their middle school years both refused to go to a second one because the decibel level was painful for them.
We don’t need to harm kids’ hearing for them to have a good time together.
myrmepropagandist
in reply to Pomegranate_Stew • • •Yeah I never got that. The kids at the school where I work don't like loud music but it's a very nerdy school.
I think some people like it for some reason, though. Extroverts need to be studied.
Kostek Poland
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •mizblueprint
in reply to myrmepropagandist • • •